Speeches by Norman.

“MDM is the new vehicle.”

“So you have not been consulted either.”

“Presumably, you try to indigenise the application of the technology, even if you could not indigenise the core technology, so it became part of our sovereign—”

“How do you think about foreign companies where we know that the ultimate loyalty of the company will not be to British interests, and where the IP is not held as a sovereign matter in this country?”

“An emphasis for you would be on placing your bets—your investment—as National Armaments Director more on the sovereign side of that equation, if you can, for relevant capability.”

“And companies could borrow in order to supply the demands made by MoD for more kit. Is that right?”

“And you support that, in line with the comment you made to Fred.”

“I mean sovereign British drone companies. I do not mean outsourced, foreign organisations setting up here. I am interested in sovereign capability. I think we should all be interested in sovereign capability, because that is what is going to count.”

“In a recent exercise, it was reported that a brigade was essentially wiped out by a Ukrainian-style drone attack. We have many drones businesses in this country—part of our sovereign capability—that can sell to Norway, Denmark, the United States and even into Ukraine via Kindred, but not to the MoD for the defence of t…”

“So the MoD could borrow using this facility, to supplement the investment that it is making through the national spending process.”

“Okay. The Treasury realised that the fact that we were in a conflict allowed it to release some money, even though there was a separate argument about the defence investment plan?”

“The defence investment plan was promised by the end of the year in the SDR—which is another defect in the SDR. When you say that the Department is stretched, of course that’s right. Is it right that the Treasury made available some additional contingency funding to meet the current concern?”

“We will await the statement. Obviously, I have now got the press release and circulated it to the Committee—which I think should have been done beforehand by the Department—but it is not absolutely clear as to whether this is a demand side intervention or a supply side intervention. Is its purpose to buy more kit, or i…”

“It was obviously never contemplated that Dragon would be needed, or it would have been sent in the way that the other missile systems were deployed, as you have described. They never contemplated that Dragon would be needed, and it had to be sent afterwards when it was realised that Cyprus was at risk.”

“I am sure the answer to this question is no, but do you think it is a possible criticism of the SDR or, indeed, the Department, that they were withdrawing assets from the Gulf and were very slow—six weeks’ notice has been mentioned in the media—to send HMS Dragon, and that this reflected their preoccupation with NATO a…”

“The SDR talks about a “NATO first” strategy, but what this has shown is that actually the Middle East is not a secondary theatre; it is arguably the most important global theatre at the moment—so that invalidates the SDR. Do you accept that?”

“Let me suggest several areas in which the SDR now looks quite weak. First, the capacity to deploy military force is much slower than was anticipated even in the SDR. Secondly, it looks like we have limited force mass, certainly by sea—as demonstrated. Thirdly, we have evident long-term constraints on our maritime capac…”

“National armaments director, do you share the view that the recent conflict has not shown any weaknesses in the SDR?”

“Okay, but does it show any weaknesses in the SDR?”

“Okay. Well, may I suggest that you speak to him on our behalf? I am sure I speak for the whole Committee when I say that this is a deplorable piece of briefing that no Government should be associated with, and I hope you will send him the very best from this Committee. I hope colleagues will join me in that. The second…”