Speeches by Tufnell.

“The big complaint was that there was no comprehensive assessment of cutting or non-management scenarios in respect of the evidence base that you set out.”

“Abigail, do you recognise that, in terms of duplication?”

“Can I touch on this point about the licences and the changes in the peat depth. It has gone to less than 30 cm compared with the previous 40 cm. I understand that a lot of that change was underpinned by Natural England’s evidence review. I should declare an interest that my dad has been a non-executive board member of …”

“Paul, do you have anything to add? Do you recognise that lack of services compared with NHS England?”

“Yes.”

“The Future Landscapes Forum claimed there was no published scientific evidence supporting the claim that 30 cm is superior to 40 cm.”

“Building on what Henrietta just set out, evidence has been submitted that the licence process is overly complex, slow and impractical, and that it had to go to Ministers for personal approval in order to get that through. That does not necessarily sit well with what Henrietta just set out. Can you comment on that, Sall…”

“Does that concern you?”

“As a Welsh MP, I want to bring in this aspect around devolution. Keeping with controlled fires and prescribed burning, obviously you have different regimes. In Wales, we have a burning season. As Natural England, how do you interact with those devolved regimes, and how do you learn from them? What is that process like?”

“It sounds like a very minimum interaction.”

“My final question is about whether you think this is working. What aspects of the collaboration require the greatest improvement in respect of your individual health boards and the JCC? I will start with Phil.”

“Building on what Henrietta just set out, evidence has been submitted that the licence process is overly complex, slow and impractical, and that it had to go to Ministers for personal approval in order to get that through. That does not necessarily sit well with what Henrietta just set out. Can you comment on that, Sall…”

“Sure, but in terms of gathering evidence, understanding what is going on, looking at different ways to approach this issue?”

“How does that work? You have these established relationships with Agnes Hunt and Bristol. If you want to move to a virtual consultation with a particular consultant in those areas, or if you want to change the appointment to facilitate that transport, what does that look like with those contractual agreements that are …”

“So this is something that you are aiming towards rather than something that happens now.”

“I want to quickly follow up on Gerald’s question with you, Phil. Ben and Ann have left, but you presumably face additional challenges in your area given the level of distance—you have to cover Carmarthen all the way up to Borth. The geographical area is greater than what some of your colleagues on the call cover. Do yo…”

“Thank you. Can I come back to the question that Ben asked earlier about the JCC? We have had evidence from Llais and others. Let me quote some of the written evidence from Llais: “When something goes wrong, people don’t know whether to complain to the English provider, the Welsh health board, or both. Different timesca…”

“So you would dispute the fact that you did not assess those two situations in terms of cutting and non-management?”

“Are you able to put a figure on it?”

“On the relationship with the JCC, how do you find that? From what you are saying, it sounds like you try your level best to avoid them. You create those established pathways, and that works better than going through—”