Speeches by Dollimore.

“Is it not fair to ask your creditors to take a bigger haircut and not ask the taxpayer—the country—to let you off the hook on £1 billion for fines?”

“You do not think it is sustainable? We are talking about a £17 billion deal and between £1 billion and £1.4 billion in fines.”

“So is it the creditors who are lobbying the Government?”

“You have said in your accounts that were published this morning that you expect it will take 10 years to fix sewage dumping in the Thames. Are you asking to be let off the hook for 10 years as part of this regulatory reset?”

“Thames is lobbying Government for a smaller haircut for its creditors and being let off these fines. That is quite clear.”

“Whether we are talking about fines or penalties is slightly beside the point here. Thames is asking for a carve-out, to be let off the hook for penalties or fines that are due, and people will find it very hard to understand why you should be given that exception. It appears you are also calling for that for the entire…”

“Can you let me finish? Is Thames not effectively holding a gun to the Government and the taxpayer’s head? it is basically saying, “You’ve got to let us off these fines or you’ll have a special administration regime.””

“Is that a yes or a no, Chris?”

“You are asking for all water companies to be let off fines, effectively.”

“Are you only allowed to raise bills on the basis of meeting those targets?”

“The people who live outside London will probably feel they are quite important and essential to fix too.”

“It makes no difference to the creditors?”

“To refer back to our last evidence session, Sir Adrian, our exchange was about why there was such an emphasis on maintaining the senior leadership and not the junior roles, the frontline roles, the 700 vacancies that Jayne has referred to. Just to be clear, that is the point I was making. Many people will look at the m…”

“Have you written to any Ministers outside DEFRA to ask to be let off the hook from fines?”

“Many taxpayers will find it extraordinary that Thames Water wants a special exception; it wants to be let off the hook from £1.4 billion of fines. Why should you get a special exception?”

“Just on that point—may I refer the House to my register of interests—the biggest union that represents Thames Water staff is the GMB. It has written to us to say that there was widespread disbelief when the chairman described senior managers as the company’s greatest asset. It has also said that industrial relations ar…”

“Just DEFRA, no other parts of Government?”

“That is the estimation of figures over the next few years that you have provided in your evidence to us for both the EA and Ofwat fines.”

“They do not feel that way. Actually, the impact of the evidence session last time was dismay and disbelief. It did not motivate the people they represent.”

“What do you judge of its assessment? KKR’s official reasoning that it gave us is that it was worried about the political landscape in which it was entering in terms of Thames Water, but nothing has really changed in the political landscape between the general election last July and KKR pulling out. The Water (Special M…”